outfarm them, splitpush, find them while they are alone or in small groups, need to work as team also. Keep them seperated pretty much
git gud
As i started to play DOta2 i was shit too.
I kept playing and learned of my mistakes till i git guder.
Start to understand the game and not a fucking hero.
nothing.
your team forced you to first pick mid, enemy team picked 5 hard counters. its your teams fault that you lost that match, not the fact that you first picked mid in a ranked match. your teammates that flamed you for it and brought you so far to write a post on dotabuff were wrong, they are the problem, not you.
heres what you wanted to hear
Lol, why 3k players telling me to get good.
I'm 5k main, what r u talkin about.
I was interested in some advanced strategies, but not only in advices about splitpush.
Well, an advice about outfarming was really good, but can only be usefull if ur hero good at farming, and ur team isn't throwing with a score around 0 20
Well in this situation i think the more high the bracket is the more fucked you are...
In a pro game if 1 team pick shit and get hard countered they just write gg at begin i suppose :D
Anyway if is only your hero the one countered maybe consider to play him as a support role if its possible?
This will fuck the early enemy tactic and give the space and the weapons for your team to counter them and win the game..
Just my 3k cents...
A vague and stupid question warrants a vague and stupid answer.
Try to destroy the enemy ancient.
Just figure out what items counter the counters and do your best o survive. I played a Game as CK vs Ember, Lich, ES, Enchantress and Lina. My Build that day was Armlet, BKB SE, Linkens, Euls. Worked like a charm. I was fucking hard to kill. Several times I euls dodged an echo or a Lich ult. The linkens did great combined wih armlet for their many slows and the mana regen fromlinkens allowed me survivability despite all their burst. SE for mobility if euls failed I could invis forcing dust and of course BKB to actually tank smoething for my team. Needless to say I was the counter to them LOL. It was also hilarious SEing up to Ember split pushing a lane Ulting in trees and lobbing stun from trees into a 2 shot kill wit rift. Worked well.
BTW i've seen pros and boosters which are 6-7k+ building full-defence on heroes, but it's not clear for me how to win on low-ranks, when being countered by all enemy team, and when ur teammates are mostly retarded)
It's told about 4k bracket. I can win on lower ranks just by outfarming and playing 1x5 as that was told.
the main answer should be - carefully, you play carefully, u dont team fight until you get items that solve your deficiencies
You guys are talking about anything but not a plan pr strategy for a game.
The main point here, that u play carefully on any hero till get items u need to do thing in the game.
The problem of that point is, that when u are countered by 3 or 4 enemy herous u wont be able to outplay most of them even if build 7 slots, just because of mechanics.
Simple example for u to help u to understand an idea. TA fp got countered by 4 DoTs and cant even do something on line, ganks or in teamfights. The only option left for here is to build a lot of escape and splitpush, going last into fight to burst enemy hero with +1. THAT would be a gameplan. "Git gud" or "Get items" is ont a kind of gameplans.
Other example. I played with 7k booster who fp SF on 4.8k average, get countered by a strong roaming composition and forced to go jungle almost from the beggining, went for a tank build, made some pick-offs on solo targets and won a game, just by being a target for enemies in every teamfight. THAT was his gameplan also.
So, i ask u again, what kind of gameplans do you know, that helps you to win a game against all-counterpick matchups?
The main point here, that u play carefully on any hero till get items u need to do thing in the game.
Nope, if you are a counter to enemy core, you are supposed to play aggresively not carefully! it is because you are counter and do not need items to punish enemy's pick
Also define a word "gameplan" since you give it some special meaning that none of us is aware
or you just buy bkb and dots dont do anything. just buy proper items. dota is a team game and if you ignore that because "im perfect and my allies suck literally 100% of the time" then no advice or guide will help you. just tell your teammates to pick heroes that can help you or buy items that can help you.
I guess one way to look at it is to think about how the enemy counters you, and then don't build or play your hero that way. For example, AA counter's necro by making him unable to heal, so as necro you would probably not bother getting mek, and build your hero around his other strengths. You could go the ebalde dagon build for example and build Necro to delete one hero instead of trying to be an unkillable healing machine like normal.
Its very rare that the enemy will counter literally every single strong aspect of your hero. If they do, then I guess just try build to help your team carry instead.
Please note I am not saying the dagon build is good, its just an example.
I am 5k mayne why are you talking to me
please only advices from ghgod and miracle
also, its my teams fault
Not 5k but from what I observe at high mmr games, it's really simple, u play around what is possible, given the pressure their heroes apply on you on the map. U don't want to hear it, but it essentially means play safe. It means don't make aggressive moves. So basically because they limit your options by countering u, u automatically are at a disadvantage no matter whAt. Hence the game plan to splitpush is not incorrect. It is a game plan. There's no secret strat.
In fact it might be your only option. Your only chance at winning is by splitting them up while they constantly try to pressure you (they are trying to convert their own advantage over you into a win). So play defensively and wait for overextensions right? Simple Dota.
The mistake most ppl make is not understanding that they have an advantage and hence u get 20 0 scores. But u don't need me to tell u that. It's inevitable.
But high mmr players will avoid bad fights much better of course and the result is outfarming (already mentioned), which improves your chances. To win despite being disadvantaged. Usually those games are won by baiting enemy teams into over extension.
I could tell u to sneak rosh but that's not very helpful advice.
Assuming you are losing, you will still lose 1/50 of those games u are heavily countered. But these strats prepare u for that one game u can win when enemy overextends.
I Guess one game plan u could think about is how to convert overextensions into a win which is much harder. It is to try and get the enemy to take a bad fight at a disadvantage and chain feed. Can't really tell u how to set this up as I'm not good player but this is just what I observe from watching games.
goddamn it i was too late to post my meme.
But yea, it's a stupid vague question without any context or examples.
p.s 50% winrate at 3k mmr LUL
5k main LUL
Play around it. They may be a full team of counter picks, but when do they come online? What is their team synergy? How many heroes in your team do they counter?
Theoretical example: i first pick meepo and got a sven shaker lich counter pick. I go support. Completely ruin their gameplan, so many counter picks just for a support.
Dota may place a lot of emphasis on the draft, but if you've got the skill and communication, you could play around a heavy losing draft and still win. Never. Give. Up. If you did, might as well switch to League.
but then you have a meepo support, a hero who simply can't support so you become way beyond useless.
^just support in the basic sense of buying all the support shit like wards, smoke and shit. And be the safelane zoner early on. Then transition to 4th core later on.
Fine, disclaimer, only works below 4K. Happy? Haha
(Btw, Meepo 4 support is sub-optimal, but can be a good curveball. Look for it, a pro team ran it before and won)
Disclaimer: If you think support is only a harass and ward bitch then you're playing support for the enemy team.
Into your counters you play like this:
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/3477792222
We had last pick Meepo into both Sven and WW. U have to dominate early game and finish the game asap. I dont think there's other way unless you are 5 smurfs vs 3k stack.
@Sup or feed
Yeah, you have to play agressive if it's possible, but that does not mean that u should not be careful and went dieing 1x5 with ur streak.
@Aggressive Perfector
Well, building a BKB is also a gameplan. Actually, when u build BKB on TA u lose an opportunity to build an alternative slot that could be used for other aims.
I've written that thread to discuss an overall strategies to win against counterpicks.
Well, now i figured out 2 things:
1) Building hard defence and be a bait in teamfights.
2) Outfarming while splitpushing, when it's possible.
Other thing that was told are quiet useless in the context of thread.
P.S.
@Brutal. Savage. Rekt.
58% winrate on 3.9 bracket on heroes that i havn't main and wish to train more LUL
Building defensive items in the first place vs your late game counters is retarded. You have to dominate the map, take control of the game. Tryhard counterpickers usually are not very good with the hero itself.
Sub 50% on 3k, 5k main ... mkey.
Carry is the only role who will get the most counterpick by the opponent team. How could they have 3-5 hero to counter u, so u are suck on the drafting. Your question is absurd and not logic, sir.
i can play any heroes i don't main in 3-4k and i still get bare minimum 80% wr
and im pretty sure any 5k+ player would have at least 70%
@Lex
I would like to see you playing Sf against BH-Tinker-Bane-LD carry and random offlane SOLO.
Ill repeat 1 more time for stupid: SOLO.
Coz u cant rely on ur team even in high ranked games.
I created that acc like in a year of 2012 and played around 400 games.
Check last month stats lol
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I mean it's simple to understand what should u do to deal with 1 or 2 counter of ur hero on oposite team.
But what's with situations when, for example, ur enemies got 3 up to 5 heroes to destroy exactly ur hero.
PLS dont write here stupid advices like "play safe", "know the time, when u can dominate" or "build deffensive items".
It's all goes without saying and there is no need to repeat that cases.
At all that is the question rather for 5-6k+ players, since they better know the overall strategies and can advice some of gameplanes to be used against counters.
Also, u may probobly wonder why do u even have to play against that much counters. I'll make it clear. Look, boy there are a lot of situations in rankeds especially, when u have to get ur firstpick coz u dont want to have on ur midlane 0.01 versatility invoker with 450 gpm average or wish to spam a strong hero, so u need to take it gets already picked.