General DiscussionNeed some meepo coaching

itemchoices,
try to get good items, try to initiate, try to pick off imporant heroes.
Agha blink hex aaaaaaaaaalways

I don't think I am good enough to teach you, but have you decided yourself, what do you want to improve? Decision making? Item choices? Playstyle?

where do you lane meepo?
your items choices seem to be good one for most part so that ain't the problem. and i doubt you have micro problems otherwise you wouldn't be playing meepo (although you can be infinitely good in this regard, it varies from person to person) in the first place.

so what exactly do you have issues with? decision making?

I have problem with my decision making when i'm level 4-11
I think i should gank cause i got two meepo but if the gank fail reaching level 11 would be slow down a lot.
I want to be able to reach level 11 as quickly as possible because at that time you could start to get solo kill.
I don't know if this is enough information but i will put in more detail if you want me to.
Have a good day

I have been going mid lane lately and it seem to work out if i get an early kill from this guy in mid or the guys on the other lane.

well some generalizations.
people are still not used to meepo lvl4 so you can always try to surprise them with it. sometimes it works if you move on for the kill just before last creep dies giving you 4th and a 2nd mappo.
from lvl4 you want to start stacking rather than start ganking. stack big camp 2/3 times then clear it when you get the chance, kill camp next to it and drain your 2nd mappo fully. you don't really want to start roaming before you get your travels (more on this later). around 11 you should have both travels and meka and a dagger or thereabouts so you can start mass ganks, before that you focus on your core/level up.

I might gank if I feel mid is too hard to stay and side lane 2 heroes are being supper aggressive and pushing carelessly so I might send 1 hero to score a gank, or if you find a good ganking rune and above mentioned situation occurs. otherwise you want stay mid.

now more on what im doing, and what you could experiment with.
make meka always. I know you might want support to get it, or he might say he'll make it, but in fact you don't. you can't always rely on someone else to do the healing, at a time when you find appropriate. not to mention your support with meka wont ever have the same mobility like you do, so you need to have meka of your own.
if they already made headdress, just ask them to turn it into pipe.
rush travels. with flawless early game where you score a fb and get a tower you have them minute 5.(that game is won).
with a bit more rocky start you get them minute 10ish, normally somewhere in between like 7/8. 3 branches/ring/salve/tango/clarity. ring into basi, then boots into travel. meka/dagger/agha/hot.
lvl 6/7 insta clears wave. put basi on always. if mid hero goes for a rune/gank always use that time to push tower. can't count the times when I killed tower mid while their midder was roaming. that tower kill and 1/2 big camp stack gives you travels.
from there on you can start roaming. you might die (will die) sometimes, but that shouldn't prevent you from having both dagger and meka by the time you hit 11/12. from there on you know the drill.

so get 2nd meepo. use double poof/clear wave, and go stack with 2nd one. rinse repeat. try travels first, dont get treads (most certainly don't get tranq), keep pressuring mid until you kill the tower and finish travels. fact is, most mid heroes will go in for a gank effectively letting you free farm which will help you snowball faster. only gank if mid is some ubercrap hero like od or if enemies are pushing too much and you can come in from behind. otherwise prioritize farm exp/gold wise. those minutes are crucial. later when you get your core you know you can snowball and finish the game with 10+ levels, that's a different story tho.

i will try that
what starting item do you like to go for
what if you go to the sidelane
do you still do the same thing

i don't go side lane.
when I'm really forced to, I'll do very much the same, but been playing meepo mid since dota league.

starting items 2 branches salve tango clarity and ring of prot. usually bring sobi to finish basi and then boots.
or if I feel I might get a kill early might grab boots before sobi.

what if you face qop or od in mid lane
wont it be a easy lane for them
would you me mind joining my party and coach me when you have time
would really appreciate it
have a good day

All you need is to tell your team you have perfect micro skills, perfect micro skills, perfect micro skills...

youtube.com/watch?v=lTgPlOL52dQ

That's why I never go for travels/meka first. Travels give no suviability/damage and cost a lot. Meka is more then a blink, 1/2 aghs, which I think are more crutial. I always try to carry a tp instead. With the nerf of night vision, I feel like the only option is to go aggressive, get pt, blink. I used to play the old tranquils->rush aghs, heart/blink, armlet, then roam, simply kill people who are stupid enough to fight me not 4v1. But with the vision and tranquilsForCarry nerf, it is harded to do that, safely farm/stack jungle. I have to adjust and lost lots of meepo games recently, more experienced player now don't fight me 1v1, 2v1 anymore, winrate dropped from 58 to 51, life is hard.

there are some lanes where you have hard time. meepo ain't exactly the best hero for mid.
qop in particular can be troublesome tho i had games go both ways.
if qop is at least a tiny bit careless you can kill her as she is quite squishy if netted. it's really is dependant of lineup and players themselves. do you have someone to gank? is qop being super aggressive? etc etc. ultimately if you really have trouble with it you can try to gank or farm woods if you feel you can't contest her mid.

prob with the coaching is that I'm very scarce on time. I don't have a pc and all my games have been played from internet cafe. think I will get a new pc soon and if you still face same problems by then I don't see why not.
alas as things stand now I won't be able to. sry :/ perhaps if I happen to be in cafe and not playing, but don't hold your breath.

edit: ^I knew a guy who would go woods rush agha and make vlads/curiass then just a-move his mappos mid. that's bad. pros play meepo side lane because it is way safer, and because they will stack woods for you, not leech your exp and bbysit you if need be. unless you are playing on that level and in those circumstances you shouldn't be taking an excerpt from professional game as an example.
mid is the most riskiest lane, but bears most rewards, mastering something like meepo mid is a daunting task for many. but it can be used to such effect, especially in pubs/inhouses.
also movement speed give you so much survivability, often more than 8 str you get from treads. it's also a lot harder to execute properly and can be a bit overwhelming at times. but for those who can't be bothered.. woods/vlads/agha/cur right click.

I took that game as an example of a meepo with expensive travels, blink being almost completely useless because he gets wiped out in seconds, does not do much damage.

>also movement speed give you so much survivability, often more than 8 str you get from treads.

Lol. You are doing it wrong. You don't simply run from people, and if you do, just juke with poofs. And 8str early is quite a lot. And the attack speed. Unless you are playing some kind of splitpushing ratdota meepo-tinker.

i know my game isnt the highest level but i am pwning people at my skill lately
check my replay
rushing bot is quite good if the opponent dont rush to end the game

yes, you simply run from people sometimes. net and run. net and tp. you can't always poof away in safe fashion. sometimes you just need to run to safety and out of reach. having tp on every hero also gives way more escaping options. travels are way superior boots and a must on every top meepo player.
8 str amounts for something like 150ish hp which is helpful but not a prerequisite, attack speed is neglectable with 2/3 meepos whose main dps comes from poof early on.

and this has been my favorife hero since I switched from wc3 to dota years ago, and most played one, simply because of micromanaging aspect that I was used to in skirmishes and which dota lacked. and have been playing it at the highest level possible for a pub player these past, I dno, 7 years or so. be it on dl/dlg/rgc you name it. was one of few that would actually play meepo in tryhard vip league, and was wildly recognized as best meepo on these latter two platforms.
you will struggle finding someone more knowledgeable and experienced when it comes to this hero. but you can always chose to dismiss anything you don't agree with, it's your prerogative. I'm just saying it would be a foolish thing to do.

obviously my way of playing changed vastly over the years, and I was tailoring it to suit my very aggressive play style. for those in similar shoes, and capable of pulling it off, this would be the best way to play it.
but again, to each his own. I'm not trying to establish some kind of superiority complex but merely offer a helping hand when asked for.
take that as you will.

edit: @mpsk what time are you compared to CET?

>8 str amounts for something like 150ish hp which is helpful but not a prerequisite, attack speed is neglectable with 2/3 meepos whose main dps comes from poof early on.

The blink-poof does not do that much damage. With an Orb of Venom and two levels in geosike, you can usually just run people down now at level 4 with a bit of support, so I sometimes prefer to do that in a solo safe lane.

I>and this has been my favorife hero since I switched from wc3 to dota years ago, and most played one, simply because of micromanaging aspect that I was used to in skirmishes and which dota lacked. and have been playing it at the highest level possible for a pub player these past, I dno, 7 years or so. be it on dl/dlg/rgc you name it. was one of few that would actually play meepo in tryhard vip league, and was wildly recognized as best meepo on these latter two platforms.
you will struggle finding someone more knowledgeable and experienced when it comes to this hero. but you can always chose to dismiss anything you don't agree with, it's your prerogative. I'm just saying it would be a foolish thing to do.

I can't see that, I can only see 150 games, can I? I've seen N0tail play meepo, he has successfully done it in competitive, I would probably listen to this guy http://dotabuff.com/players/15478778, as he has a high winrate against experienced players with lots of games.

well started d2 like 2 months ago. and like I said only playing from cafe so no more than 200 games.
I wrote that to explain what I'm saying comes from experience, not to play devils advocate and argue for arguing sake.

also stats are easily altered for the most part. especially in d2 environment.

xan i'm ahead of you by 8 hours :D
i'm studying in japan at the moment
would love to see more of your meepo gameplay

i think notail is very good in his own's right

oh lol, wanted to say I might be playing tonight some from cafe but you will be well asleep at that point xD
what are you studying? I should have finished mine ages ago :/
well I added you anyways, if you have a problem with smth chances are you could find what you look for in some of the replays if I'm not around.

You can read my Meepo guide on Steam, I'm actually a pretty good Meepo player (not boasting for the sake of it).
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=190733151

Meepo is a hero who can played as a hard-carry or a ganker. I always play it as a hard-carry, in fact that's the only carry that I play. Otherwise, I would play supports. I assume you can micro Meepo to the extent that you can bring a dying Meepo back during teamfight.
Since the Aghanim's Upgrade, you get 100% stats sharing for all Meepos. Hence, you shouldn't get aura items as your core items, get more stats item instead. Your core items are Dagger and Aghanim's and Boots. I don't specify the Boots because, despite Power Tread being the best for Meepo due to IAS and Stats for all Meepos, Phase Boots are great to a certain extent for difficult situation and Boots of Travel is a must at late-game, especially when strategies are changing rapidly.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Giving up your Power Tread for Boots of Travel would decrease your Attack Speed.

Ethereal Blade, Eye of Skadi and Heart are the highest stats items in the game. Ethereal Blade and Eye of Skadi is also useful, they provide slow disable and Ethereal Blade combos well with Poof if used well.

So far, of all the recent games of Meepo that I've played, I didn't get any aura items. My teammates buy them. Playing alone in pub may be difficult because players simply don't see Meepo as a hard-carry and if you lose, you are apparently the fault. Sarcasm or stupidity? I dunno. Also, it depends on which region you play in.

I realised that you often get Mekansm, I suggest you be the one getting Vladimir's Offering instead of Mekansm and here's the reason. The Mekansm is for the whole team and sometimes, your primary Meepo may not be with your team, after all, you're not a support. The Lifesteal would also provide yourself more EHP in the long-run because you're the hard-carry. Finally, both cost about 2000 gold so it's a fair comparison.

Another good reason for Meepo to not buy aura items is because you would have less ability to tank. Assuming you're already getting countered badly by AoE disables and you hold Mekansm, AC and Offering, you're the aura-guy but you are not gonna help much for you team. Just think about it for a moment. And that's probably why sometimes tankers instead of supports get Mekansm.

^All the item suggestions are entire trash.

Why would you spend money on heart/skadi to boast your meepos (You dont even profit from heir active effects really!) when you could just get a hex, pick off the most important hero in their team and WIN THE GAME.
Im not a meepo player myself however I guy in my team plays meepo (ex-sc player) and we played like 30 games lose-less, toppages, tournaments, everything

dotabuff.com/players/129610677/matches?game_mode=&hero=meepo&match_type=real&page=2 here for some inspiration
dont be creeps and add my friend, however you can download some replays

just a quick reply. i used to go hex all the time before, these days not so much. after agha got boosted to 100% stat share, your clones have 3.4k hp at lvl 25 after hot. thats A LOT. hex helps tremendously, but vs organized teams they will burn one your meepo down. dead carry=useless carry. so you should look to stay alive, first and foremost.

anyway
ok so i took some time out to see your 2 reps. last one you won, and last one you lost. and i have to say i liked what i saw, you took up advices well, and used it with success.
dont distress about the loses. sometimes your team just wont let you win, no matter how hard you try, or how well you play. if you have 4 carries and no support and they "play for fun" while getting analed whole game long there is so little you can do about it. as long as you are satisfied with your own performance thats all that matters.

some small "fixes" you could work on.
when sending "dead" meepo to base, take some time out and make a detour if you can stack a camp. i know 1st thing that comes up to mind is go back to safety, but usually you can just take a detour and spend ~30 seconds to stack a camp then go back to heal.
when you are waiting with 2nd meepo to stack, try to time it a bit better. for example you dont have to sit for 50 seconds in front of a camp doing nothing. check the nearby camp, and if there are small creeps you can clear them out, then proceede to stack big camp. even if its a big camp you dont have to kill it fully. just try to utilize the time spent. best you can do is send meepo when its new minute, clear mini camp, go to big one wait 10ish and stack, go back to small camp thats respawned and clear it again, then go to base to heal.

im not gonna say you shouldnt let jungle creeps kill you, you already know that, mistakes do happen.

when you are down, and trailing your enemies exp/gold wise, always try to get meka before dagger. you can get dagger 1st if you feel like you are already dominating game and dont face any real threats. usually try to opt for meka, especially if you are behind.
try to skip vlads, leave that to supports. or get it after your "must have" items.

anyways, you did well lately. it takes some time getting used to it fully, but you seem capable enough pulling it out.
especially liked that lvl 4 tryout kill at zeus, not taking ulti to scare him off, instead being patient to try with a surprise kill.
keep up the good work!

iWin4Arka, do you know seeing one Meepo player being successful when he always buy Scythe of Vyse doesn't mean buying Scythe of Vyse is always right? You don't only learn through experience, you also need to think. Furthermore, saying that my suggestions are trash without any reason doesn't prove anything. This is one major problem with people these days.

Do you know how much is 25 more STR? That is (25*19 = 475) HP which allows you to tank one to two AoE nuke. If you're against heroes with AoE disables, you should at least get a Reaver first. Scythe of Vyse isn't going to always help, it's more of a situational item. After all, you're a AGI hard-carry. It's also not about the active/passive abilities of the items that you want. It's the stats. If you must, going for 3 EoS can really eat your opponent. Your teammates aren't fake too, you probably don't even need Scythe of Vyse if disables are sufficient.

^If you play vs counters positioning is way more important than raw hp. At a point where the game is EVEN, regardless of your tankyness a team can focus down any hero unless special abilitys dont allow them to do so (BKB etc.). Meepo does not have such ability, if he gets cogged, lassoed or whatever he is a dead meepo, regardless of tankyness.

If you are stomping one could say that every item works.

If it is an even game a flat amount of hp such as for a reaver that is 3200, i would rather spend it on different items. Also if it actually is an even game there is the possibility of the game dragging to lategame and therefor rendering survivability in form of flat hp more useless. Why wouldnt you invest into an item which can win you a game at any point in exchange for pure hp.
Its just mindblowing.

If you are behind hp is not an issue, you will never be tanky, might as well try to farm safely and splitpush and get the occasional pickoff with hex and blink that is :3

In my opinion should not be played as wall of hp but he should wait for the initial barrage to be spilled and then join he battle by instantly picking of an important hero.

Don't get me wrong I think it is cool that you played that amount of meepo games and you might know your stuff, however I don't believe your approach would barely work in top-page games nor highskilled competitive games. A hero that consumes a lot of space would just farm survivabitly and hope to endure the battle sounds not really appealing. Since you talk about the #1 position a hero that consumes most space shouldnt be played like this and hex really gives you the instantkill potential you need, I can see your HP attempt work if you arent necessarily the one dishing out the damage and therefor have antoehr carry.

Either way Im out of her, goodluck with your style.

used to think that too, changed my mind over time. one thing is to theory craft about it, completely another to actually do it. and it works vs your 'page1' as well.
besides, there are just too many variables to make a foolproof build, tanky one just averages better in huge amount of games, even if it's not optimal all the time.

thank you
i am still trying to improve
in some games i am not able to get boot of travel
what should i do in that case
go back and play the normal style ?

meepo is a hard carry, the item will depend who he is matching with. if you are mid with qop. basilius and meka would be the first item to choose. (you will not go mid if you are the only carry in your team) when i reach level 4 i always send my 2nd dup in different lane to help ganking or to have an easy escape if my main is in trouble. map awareness is all you need

warlock and sven are the only heroes im having trouble when picking meepo. (in late game)

in random games they are indeed problem. sven especially, he just rips you apart. if you have silencer in team you can jump on warlock and take it out before he drops rocks.
the latest I got travel was around 20. I'm pretty stubborn in that regard. still you can turn the games around lots of times.

and meepo is not a hard carry. void is. spectre is. meepo is not.

xan
i always have this one friend who is very good
i have trouble playing against him or playing with him cause he make me feel like i'm a noob
i don't think i could go meepo against him in a 1v1 mid
i know this might sound selfish but when you have time could you go 1v1 against him for me
i would be able to learn a lots from that
btw what hotkeys do you use ?
i use f1 for real meepo
1= all meepo 2=2nd meepo 3=3rd meepo...
`is for all clone
i am trying out the quickcast hotkey at the moment
it remove the click from the action however the big downside that i really hate is when you want to poof a meepo by pressing on it portrait at the left hand corner (it doesn't work)
i need to press on the mini-map which require a lots of accuracy and cause me lots of death (the quickness of the blink combo did bring me lots of success though)
what would you recommend
i was thinking of going back to the old hotkey because of this one small problem lol
sry for the long and hard to understand post
i like to write whatever is in my mind right now which is a bunch of meepo related problem

sure thing. if I'm around we can play. is he also +8 to cet?
but I told you, there are some lanes you can't win, and that's fine, you have bigger picture in mind.

groups
1 main meepo, 2 all meepos except main (so I select 2nd group and poof with them)
using f1/f2 etc for each meepo individually (it was default setup in old dota, here you have to hold down ctrl and f1/f2/f3/f4/f5 to put each meepo in corresponding group to resemble hero layout wc3 was using)

don't know what quick cast is mate, so I can't comment on that.

yea i tried changing back but i'm used to quickcast now lol
i really like meepo
but to tell the truth i still don't think i can play him in a higher level match
i am used to my hot-keys now so changing would be impossible
(just want to know what others are using)
do you have builds you can recommend ?
when you send your low hp meepo back in a fight do you send it directly to your fountain or just somewhere around their
(pressing on the mini-map to send back seem to take time)
i am having so much success with your quick bassil/travel build
all my friends are amaze at me but i still think i have a whole lots to improve
i really want to show my friend that i can play him in a cm match
that is my goal
sry for another long boring post :D

its all right. playing hearthstone so plenty of time to read in between : )
what is quickcast?? not sure what are you used to so you cant change, need to explain that a bit better.

also, i usually quick on minimap, then when i have time make sure i click on fountain.
in d1 (i think thats also in d2 now) where you pick your travels, using double click will port you on that spot where you originally picked them up.
so make sure you pick up your travels on your fountain, so when you do (for example, my hotkey for travels is "spacebar") double tap on hotkey, you will be tped back to fountain.
saves a lot of time, especially in micro intensive fights.

ask anything you want, will be here for couple of more hours, then hitting up a cafe to play some dota.

xan
dotabuff haven't been updating my gameplay lately but if you check in-game
my latest game was pretty good
i wouldn't have won that game with any different build
i was experiencing lag in the beginning so my gameplay was pretty bad but i did win the game for my team
have a good day

do you want my coach? :)

yeah i noticed the games in d2 client.
have had troubles lately myself. seems it's just one of those days where you can't win no matter what.

coolstorybro
any help would be welcome
i would love to have any kind of coaching right now :D
good to have a group of people playing meepo helping each others :D

build dagger.

i'm from SEA too.
build manta style skip dagger unless there is an OD on the enemy team.
illu get 2x stats and geostrike stacks with your real meepo so it's 7 stacks with 5 meepoes.
most important feature is that it allows you to poof two location at once.