General Discussionalch support viable?

yes

support into carry GG

Alch support you say?

oh

> Well played!

yes, i know u just looked at this post. stay bad kid

you know who you are

whoa why did nobody think about this before?

Well if someone could list how to scale the skill's that would be nice.

Cant tell if sarcasm on this post or not though

Max stats and unstable concussion to achieve the perfect balance of elements.

What do you think about acid spray? I told this dude that it would push the lane. Not to mention he was awful at throwing stuns ..

wow thats fuckin genious D:
lately i thought about potm roaming, dunno if legit tho, anybody tried it before?

Of course, you could always max acid spray and stats to achieve the perfect balance of elements.

^ potm and bane roaming lol it's been done :P and potm roams also as long as your stuns are on point

halp

You can also max arrow and stats to achieve perfect balance of uranium.

potm gif me mana

Ah yes, mana potm build requires a lot of lavra.

what are theses people saying? u dont watch chinese game... alchemist is seldom used as carry now adays.. maybe a utility carry or a support with blink + medallion Kdot bye

I agree with utility carry since he can farm up in half the time a normal carry can. But then again these are pro's who know how to stun.
I said this guy .. stunned himself more than the other team lol.

His only argument was pro's do it but even then pro's brought out the Tiny wisp combo doesn't mean everyone can pull it off

Nobody wants to achieve the perfect balance of potassium... kids these days.

A support alch with a medallion acid and stun combo can do damage up to 300-600 depending on acid levels and stun sec

Lol he really didn't do much stunning, i wasn't in his lane but whenever i tried ganking with him he'd just stun himself

#getrekt

(i maxed stun btw, but ur bad and dont notice these things)

"whenever i tried ganking with him he'd just stun himself"

got a stun on two and you failed to finish the job with a double kill, #wellplayed #promid

The potm ulti'd and i said to go for the nearest hero to us which was the storm, great map awareness though

Last game I had a support Alche which sometimes stunned himself. He said he wanted to go mid, but because I picked Viper, he went support. Somehow, it all ended in us rat dotoing.

u dont even have an argument, u keep changing it half way through. first you say alch is a bad support (which you got proved wrong), now you change your argument to "pros do it, doesn't mean u can"

so bad

my point has been fuckin proved
peace

I still think alch is a bad support compared to other supports lol. Your argument to doing it was cause you saw the pro's do it which is where that came from.
Dont hide from the discussion, if im wrong im wrong. I see now alchemist can be played as support if that's what the team really needs. I just don't think your gameplay is up to par in order to do it

http://dotabuff.com/matches/444437271

guy ista picked him and said "me supp" -with strong russian accent,
it worked

I had no argument for doing it. I chose to do it because it's strong as fuck. It was only until you bitched and your 2 other clueless friends cried: "alch isn't a support" "alch is a bad choice". That was when I had to prove my point, giving evidence such as PROS doing it as well. Oh, you don't watch pro games? Tell us more about your opinion. Needless to say you just got wrecked in this forum post.

And it's really fucking easy to play when your team doesn't suck fucking huge ass nigger dick. If I knew u were a trio of shithead morons I woulda just went straight carry

"I still think alch is a bad support compared to other supports lol."
ok then you're bad, end of discussion

what are you talking about? if you could see fy+ fenrir combo with their strong duo alche+ cm/sd = auto kill ( with smoke ganks of course)
the problem i see with alche is he can stun himself if his positioning from the opponents is very far considering also the time of his stun

good thing about alche support:
tanky support !!!!
can farm if games goes on very long
his acid spray is very annoying on clashes and pushes( that minus armor and damage is really annoying)
and his stun is very good... use for initiation, use for anti initiation if they targeted ur carry and clump up....

@sano
more like the entire team is bad. A support alch requires teamwork, proper lane equilibrium, proper smoke rotations etc, more so than other more traditional supports.

alch mid is broken as hell, just played a game
rush phase + medallion + lvl 6 = unkilllable + massive dmg

why not support drow ranger so cool.. got frost arrows on early game and chasing , silence in team fights, oh and giving ur carries damage from his 3rd skill and ultimate :D(+pushing power)

Yeah it works, I was vs 2 people that insta picked mirina and alch all of their games. And whatever lanes they were in they tended to win quite easily. I have no idea why Valve still have not fixed his fucking stun.

Alch is definitely viable as support. The basic definition of a support is a hero who can provide great utility without farm. Alch's stun + acid definitely fits this, and then he has great hitpoints to be very tough to kill.

Check this game 455390083 for a good support alch who helped us shut down a BB.

If you don't play a gank/support alch mid you wont have enough farm to have an impact solo, you need your team and thats the problem.

this went too far..

alch is one of the best sup in that meta, bitches pls, sorry for the spoil

You mean that support Alchemist Retry played? 30 minute red boots & blink?

Yeah it works, I was vs 2 people that insta picked mirina and alch all of their games. And whatever lanes they were in they tended to win quite easily. I have no idea why Valve still have not fixed his fucking stun..

i try alche support but i got flamed hard..

pick omni he will stun himself.

Well, when Alch reached lvl 6 he gets quite hard to get down. The stun is really good, long range, good dmg, long lockdown. Gank gank with more success than regular supports, and easier to get out cause of neutral tankiness.

+1 Support alch, yet my favorite carry.

Well, when Alch reached lvl 6 he gets quite hard to get down. The stun is really good, long range, good dmg, long lockdown. Can gank with more success than regular supports, and easier to get out cause of neutral tankiness.

+1 Support alch, yet my favorite carry.

support alch is as fun as support naga, support pa, support viper, support PL.. insert CARRY hero here.

Alch easily one of the strongest supps ffs, tanky, anti-push, great roamer, does a laguna blade with 4 second aoe stuns when he has a medallion. Does great when ahead, superb at maintaining pressure, while being one of the best supports at playing catch up. Versatile enough that opponents won't know how you're running him, he is one of the few heroes worth insta-locking.

I do alchemist support loads and it is completely viable. He works really well as a secondary support though and not as a solo hard support.

Alch zapport is insanely strong, just ban timber and naix and you'll be fine

did we just turn into a 2k mmr forum?

Support alch in 30 mintues get red boots and blink... carry alch (Hao) 6 slotted carry! =)

DOTAbuff skill builds shows that an Alchemist that maxes his Q and W first has nearly a 5% higher winrate than one that maxes Greed first. (60%->65%)
Yes, viable.

Alch has a long range, short cd, semi-reliable stun with decent dmg. That's all you need as roaming support. He's also a lot tankier than most common supports. Medallion, acid spray+Concoction deals tons of dmg, and he works quite well with massive armor reduction strats (SF,Venge,Dazzle,wahtever). He can also transition from support into carry/utility carry in longer games, and that's a huge difference in late game.

Even as pos5 with only medallion+blink you are a rather strong initiator with a (now) reliable stun. He can definitely be played at any position in pubs, even solo offlane might work, just to annoy the opp's melee carry with acid spray.

edit: @guy above, guess why. This build kinda requires a 4 protect 1 strat, but that rarely ever happens in pubs. And decent lasthitskills + supports stacking jungle camps. Early greed Alch is not much more than a big creep.

There are two kinds of people in this thread. The ones who understand damage types, know how to buy utility items, and understand what the word "support" actually means. And then, of course, there are those who think that you should build a hero as a carry because of one ability, think that blink dagger on Earth Shanker is bad because it gives no damage, and think that "support" is a word you use for whoever you blame for losing after you spend 50 minutes as Ursa in the jungle.